Forums
It is currently Sun Nov 19, 2017 5:22 am

All times are UTC - 8 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 972 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 61, 62, 63, 64, 65
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: Soccer Thread
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 9:07 am 
Offline
Cornice Bowl
Cornice Bowl
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 29, 2008 11:25 pm
Posts: 718
Its time to start from scratch. Burn the house down. Come up with a plan, like the Germans did.


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: Soccer Thread
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 9:25 am 
Offline
Cornice Bowl
Cornice Bowl

Joined: Mon Nov 03, 2008 3:02 pm
Posts: 643
Here's a plan - stop blaming the kids! In Long Beach alone AYSO has about 3000 kids playing. There are Extra teams that are culled from that number - largely because AYSO doesn't want to lose them to the club teams - but they do. There are at least 4 club team programs in LB that I know of. No exaggeration, that's an awful lot of development, and that's just in Long Beach...and the National Team says they have a youth development problem?!? Get outta here!

the problem is a lot higher up. Say what you want about how High Schools recruit their teams (and you wont be wrong), but where do the kids go from there? MLS seems to go out of their way to ignore NCAA. How about Semi-Pro? That seems like a dead-end, but who will keep playing on their NCAA team when MLS doesn't seem to want them and they can make a decent living while completing their education (or not unfortunately) playing Semi-Pro? Oh, but I hear you, the best players go overseas and play Internationally. Do they really? Isn't that where most of the National team was playing?

Yeah, it's the 9-year-olds, that's the problem :P

_________________
"if you can't fit your lunch in your jacket there is a good chance you are a fat. thanks bye" - Skittlekid


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: Soccer Thread
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 12:24 pm 
Offline
Kiwi Flat
Kiwi Flat
User avatar

Joined: Thu Oct 30, 2008 5:36 pm
Posts: 9120
Location: In the gurgling maw of the Pacific.
Euro has had over 100yrs to structure the program. We kicked out England developed NFL and called it football --FU. We want to compete in a system we dont participate in and as Americans we resist because its foreign. The NCAA level (also derided by Euros) I believe is the root of the restructure. It has to mesh w the system more but drafting like NFL/NBA wont work.


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: Soccer Thread
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 2:01 pm 
Offline
Cornice Bowl
Cornice Bowl

Joined: Mon Nov 03, 2008 3:02 pm
Posts: 643
The problem with following the Euro model is it is heavily dependent on the lower tier, semi pro levels. Relegation works (and is freaking awesome IMHO) because there is a support system for the next level down. In the US, MLS is just barely viable. The next level down is getting there now but has a long way to go. Using NHL as a model (because that's what they do), the lower tier may NEVER be viable, as anyone who ever attended an early Ice Dogs game can attest to. The first year they were a direct feeder team for the Ducks and were a lot of fun to watch but that got to be too expensive. The team that ended up folding years later could barely be considered "professional" in the league they were playing in and the players were never going to be in the NHL. I digress...

What the US needs to stop doing is holding all of the friendlies and pretending that MLS is as good as Premier League - it is not, at least not right now, and besides, what does that accomplish? Stop paying big bucks for retired Euro players and start paying US born "Stars" more so they will no be so tempted to go overseas to play there. Frankly I'd rather get paid a little less and get playing time than I would to get a little bigger paycheck and spend my time sitting in those comfy bench chairs - but that's me. Do whatever it takes to get recognition for the NCAA teams, at least when it comes to post-season play. Remember not only did we not make the World Cup, we have not made the last 2 Olympics either. That's the college-age players. Draw the Olympic and World Cup teams from only NCAA and MLS. There is nobody the US teams cannot live without who has chosen to go overseas to play - NOT A SIGLE PLAYER! If there was, we'd be in the World Cup, because we bent over backwards to accommodate those guys and they failed - badly.

_________________
"if you can't fit your lunch in your jacket there is a good chance you are a fat. thanks bye" - Skittlekid


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: Soccer Thread
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 2:22 pm 
Offline
Kiwi Flat
Kiwi Flat
User avatar

Joined: Thu Oct 30, 2008 5:36 pm
Posts: 9120
Location: In the gurgling maw of the Pacific.
Personally I dont care if euro clubs take US players if they play. Coming back for International duty theyll be better off for it iff there is a worldly manager to bring the USMNT into cohesion. Whoever ends up on the NT better be playing lots of minutes well somewhere.

MLS (where euro stars go after their Autumn years) isnt where an upcoming kid wants to play. They fantasize the big euro clubs and National team glory. Maybe Im internalizing.

My #2 national team is NED. They also are out of the WC. They have the structure and their talent is above average as a nation. One trouble is the talent gets farmed out to many clubs and those players dont get the minutes and when International duty comes these great talented players arent fit and/or they chronically havent found the right coach. Something.


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: Soccer Thread
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 3:15 pm 
Offline
Cornice Bowl
Cornice Bowl

Joined: Mon Nov 03, 2008 3:02 pm
Posts: 643
Clearly a successful professional program does not beget a successful WC campaign (looking at you England!). Messi meshes much better with Barcelona than he does with Argentina.

But...then there is Germany. The Bundesliga is successful but not like the Premier league. They won the WC though and it wasn't even all that close.

_________________
"if you can't fit your lunch in your jacket there is a good chance you are a fat. thanks bye" - Skittlekid


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: Soccer Thread
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 3:34 pm 
Offline
Kiwi Flat
Kiwi Flat
User avatar

Joined: Thu Oct 30, 2008 5:36 pm
Posts: 9120
Location: In the gurgling maw of the Pacific.
Well there is that history of German Nationalism.
...

Focus is such a big part in NT play. Getting those players on the same page and developing on-pitch relationships in 2wk chunks of time is challenging. I think Jurgy was close to the answer but Bruce was not. I think if it can be done, from the top down replaced w quality, we can find the already existing talent in our pool.


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: Soccer Thread
PostPosted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 9:24 am 
Offline
Dave's Run
Dave's Run
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 29, 2008 8:21 pm
Posts: 1899
the US lacks technical capability

the kids don't turn out cause the coaches don't know how to develop them

it's not a sport with a tradition and isn't one that is taken seriously, and that can still be OK

kids have nice experiences playing, and that's important

it's a self awareness problem, if anything

it's not an important sport to americans, but they feel entitled to be world beaters anyway

cause 'merica

_________________
http://jonnycoppfoundation.org/ | Make your own Legends


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: Soccer Thread
PostPosted: Tue Oct 17, 2017 12:22 am 
Offline
Cornice Bowl
Cornice Bowl
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 29, 2008 11:25 pm
Posts: 718
Our U-17 boys are kicking ass and taking names in WC right now...


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: Soccer Thread
PostPosted: Tue Oct 17, 2017 10:13 am 
Offline
Dave's Run
Dave's Run
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 29, 2008 8:21 pm
Posts: 1899
FreshPow wrote:
Our U-17 boys are kicking ass and taking names in WC right now...


ask mexico how winning youth WC tourneys does for the senior national team?

answer: it means jack

_________________
http://jonnycoppfoundation.org/ | Make your own Legends


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: Soccer Thread
PostPosted: Tue Oct 17, 2017 10:25 am 
Offline
Kiwi Flat
Kiwi Flat
User avatar

Joined: Thu Oct 30, 2008 5:36 pm
Posts: 9120
Location: In the gurgling maw of the Pacific.
And ask MEX how to RUN a national team w specific players sponsored by networks and those sponsors playing a direct role in what players are and are not fielded.

Nah. Better not ask.


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: Soccer Thread
PostPosted: Wed Oct 18, 2017 10:25 am 
Offline
Dave's Run
Dave's Run
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 29, 2008 8:21 pm
Posts: 1899
^ lmao - i once really thought they might have a model for the US

nope - they are just as closed and corrupt as things are here

in fact, we may have been trying to copy their model the whole time

claudio reyna had something to say:

http://www.goal.com/en-us/news/claudio- ... 9c89qmxyib

Quote:
"Our approach and our behavior to the sport here — to coaching, to everything, is just wrong," Reyna told Goal on Tuesday. "We’re far too arrogant. We’re far too obnoxious. We are egotistical having never won anything or done anything, and that’s not the case around the world.

...

"But the one thing that we haven’t realized, I think, when we have our American soccer people go abroad to learn, I don’t think they see the behaviors of the people and how they coach in their day-to-day work. That’s the shake-up I hope people realize more than anything.
"You go to a U-14 and U-15 coach in Spain, and they are 10 times more humble than a U-14 or U-15 coach in Connecticut, New Jersey or New York, who thinks they’re the next Pep Guardiola or Patrick Vieira.
"Until we realize that — that we’re not as good as we think we are at all levels — then I think we’re going to continue being what we are, which is mediocre."

_________________
http://jonnycoppfoundation.org/ | Make your own Legends


Top
   
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 972 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 61, 62, 63, 64, 65

All times are UTC - 8 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 6 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group